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marsella 
Rear Admiral 
Joined: 21 June 2022 Location: Antigua Jolly H Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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 Posted: 11 August 2023 at 11:48 |
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Interesting that you keep AGM and LFPOs in parallel! I somehow read in some manuals to avoid mixing different chemistries. I installed BlueSea battery switch for two banks which selects either LFPO or AGM or both combined, but I yet to explore the last option since the operating voltages are different in each case and so are their charging profiles although for the latter I just use LFPO setup for bulk/abs/float.
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Arcadia
Admiral 
Joined: 27 November 2017 Location: Sag Harbor, USA Status: Offline Points: 1112 |
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Posted: 11 August 2023 at 12:04 |
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Yes, they are very different as you say, but cause no problems with each other. They will each accept their own current based on the charge profiles. What matters is the charge voltage supplied, and that is the almost the same for both. The LFPs will take most of the current until charged. The internal BMS will shut off each unit when needed and then finally the AGMs absorb all current till charged. At that point the LFPs will be at 13.5 volts, which will happily float the AGMs. Works seamlessly. And as I said before, the AGMs can provide a good high current supply when needed (Windlass, winches), which the LFPs are not so good at, although at 1500 amp hrs, the LFPs would be fine on their own!! This set up couldn’t be simpler and has been flawless for over a year. It will run my power hunger boat for week or more without a charge.
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Leon / ARCADIA
2018 Hanse 588 Sag Harbor, NY |
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Arcadia
Admiral
Joined: 27 November 2017 Location: Sag Harbor, USA Status: Offline Points: 1112 |
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Posted: 11 August 2023 at 12:08 |
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If I could figure out a way to mount a second 180 amp Bosch to my Volvo it would be great. Cutting my engine charging time in half. Although I don’t often run my engine for charge only, when I do, twice the current and half the time would be nice.
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Leon / ARCADIA
2018 Hanse 588 Sag Harbor, NY |
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Pzucchel
Rear Admiral
Joined: 13 March 2020 Location: floating Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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Posted: 11 August 2023 at 12:09 |
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Below, the parameters suggested by Mastervolt for using the lithium
Batteries of mastervolt with the standard charger /inverter
  Edited by Pzucchel - 11 August 2023 at 12:10 |
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Hanse588#55
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Arcadia
Admiral
Joined: 27 November 2017 Location: Sag Harbor, USA Status: Offline Points: 1112 |
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Posted: 11 August 2023 at 12:31 |
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The big advantage of internal BMS if done well, is that the parameters will be specific for the LFPs. Also, redundancy, each battery has its own unit. Disadvantage is no communication to the alternator or chargers. My set up requires no communication. All components are autonomous. And I have (6) 230 amp hr units. Any failure will have a minor affect on capacity. BTW, these batteries are the exact same size and terminals as the original Hanse AGMs.
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Leon / ARCADIA
2018 Hanse 588 Sag Harbor, NY |
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boomjack
Captain 
Joined: 24 August 2014 Location: switzerland Status: Offline Points: 212 |
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Posted: 13 August 2023 at 11:07 |
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hum
 , I must confess that I am now in a deep burn out process about which wise decision I should make regarding these Lithium things...Lithium only?, lithium with agm backup?, agm again?, lithium with agm and alternator regulator? Replacing the 575 by a kayak? not easy....
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mglonnro
Commadore 
Joined: 31 July 2015 Location: Turku Status: Offline Points: 352 |
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Posted: 13 August 2023 at 11:52 |
The kayak idea is interesting!  Anyway just wanted to add my .05 about the lithium. We replaced 2 x 2 x 110Ah/12V (220Ah 24V) with SUNBEAMSystem BASIC 2 x 2 x 50Ah/24V (200Ah 24V) w/ internal BMS, and they have been great. They are charged using a Mastervolt Mass 24V charger (shore power or generator supplying 220V) or the 24V engine alternator (with internal regulator). https://www.sunbeamsystem.com/smart-lithium-plug-play/
Edited by mglonnro - 13 August 2023 at 11:52 |
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-- Mikael
https://nakedsailor.blog |
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Pzucchel
Rear Admiral
Joined: 13 March 2020 Location: floating Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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Posted: 13 August 2023 at 13:19 |
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I am getting the following general impression, staying away from the details.
(ALMOST, correction after more posts! 😉) ANYBODY THAT SWITCHED TO LITHIUM IS HAPPY OF THEIR CHOICE, despite different implantation, geometries, alternators, chargers and other electrical configurations...
DID ANYBODY THAT SWITCHED TO LITHIUM EXPERIENCED ANY PROBLEM WHATSOEVER? I think this thread is somehow giving an answer to those that are hesitating... Edited by Pzucchel - 13 August 2023 at 20:35 |
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Hanse588#55
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boomjack
Captain
Joined: 24 August 2014 Location: switzerland Status: Offline Points: 212 |
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Posted: 13 August 2023 at 15:50 |
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Hi Piero! That s an excellent synthesis!!! Anyway I already ordered the lithium…
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Wayne's World
Admiral
Joined: 18 July 2012 Location: Cruising Status: Offline Points: 1434 |
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Posted: 13 August 2023 at 17:15 |
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All,
My 2 cents - we installed 600ah of Victron branded lithium back in April 2019. A single external BMS was fitted per Victron's information. The installation was done by the apparent guru in Malta and commissioned by two techs from the Victron dealer in Malta. We also fitted a Victron battery monitor and an additional 120amp/3000w Victron charger inverter to charge the bank faster from the generator. We often had "phantom" complete 12V system shutdowns when motoring or motorsailing. After months I found the cause was the BMS over heating. The fix was forced fan ventilation of the BMS and battery area. We also suffered total 12V system shutdowns which I eventually tracked down to the BMS reacting to a low cell voltage. Although the monitor still showed 60% SOC. It took a long time to buy a Victron dongle so I could use the downloaded Victron software to look at and change the settings. After trying several time in the Med in the end I had to order the dongle from Victron Australia in Sydney and have it sent to a friend who was joining us in the Med. During the 3 years it took to sort the system Victron were of no help. They just referred me to their "Community" website - so the near sighted were leading the blind as it were. I spoke to a few Victron dealers and eventually did get some help from their guy in Aruba after we reached the Caribbean. He pointed out some cabling issues with the negative cables which I fixed. We have recently had help from a technician in Sint Maarten who seems to know his stuff. If I had known there would have need so many hard to sort issues I would have used AGM batteries again. We got 5 years out of our original AGMs before one failed. I disconnected that battery from the bank and the other 3 lasted for another 6 months before we replaced the bank with lithium. During our AGM period I didn't have any problems or need to fix any "issues". The first 3 years of our Lithium period was a pain in the arse. Lastly our insurance company asked the question at renewal time if we had fitted Lithium batteries and had they been fitted by a professional installer and to the manufacturer specifications. The inference was that if not, any damage (fire etc) which was caused by a non professional install etc would not be covered by the insurance. It seems to me to have multiple internal BMS' would be better as you would not have complete system shutdowns (hopefully). |
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Wayne W
Cruising, currently in the Pacific until the end of 2026. |
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boomjack wrote: