Difficult to hoist mainsail

Message Topic Search Topic Options Post Reply Create New Topic Printable Version Translate Topic

   Since the boat was new I have been bothered by high loads / friction when hoisting the mainsail. I have never been able to hoist fully only by hand, and more or less each time have to winch the sail at least the last half.  I seem to recall SilverSailor mentioning something about them being delighted with their electric halyard winch which was used to hoist the mainsail.

I sail regularly on a Bavaria Match 42 with a much bigger and heavier sail, and it gets hoisted easily in seconds (literally) to the mast top, then tightened by winch.  I had the same positive and negative experience on my last boat, and the commonality is that the difficult sails were fully battened, and the easy sails were not so.

Basically the battens introduce horizontal loads onto the plastic slides which makes them bind in the mast slot. Generally the headboard has a outward load on it from the leech doing the same binding in the mast slot, but the opposite direction. The entire effect is a squeeking and screeching mainsail hoist, taking a good number of minutes.

I have checked with my local North sailmaker who will happy modify my sail with roller-batten-cars which will sort the problem, for about the same price as a new sail. Not quite, but you get my point, incredibly expensive.

I have pondered about taking out the full battens, just to see how that helps. Have also pondered a single roller-batten-car only for the headboard. On my last boat I soaked the mast groove in special Teflon / PTFE spray, which helped for about a day.

Any other good ideas / experience / thoughts.

Edited by Popeye - 02 October 2006 at 21:40

Author	Message Topic Search Topic Options Post Reply Create New Topic Printable Version Translate Topic
Popeye Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 12 September 2005 Location: Mongolia Status: Offline Points: 322	Post Options Post Reply Quote Popeye Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Difficult to hoist mainsail Posted: 02 October 2006 at 21:34
	Since the boat was new I have been bothered by high loads / friction when hoisting the mainsail. I have never been able to hoist fully only by hand, and more or less each time have to winch the sail at least the last half. I seem to recall SilverSailor mentioning something about them being delighted with their electric halyard winch which was used to hoist the mainsail. I sail regularly on a Bavaria Match 42 with a much bigger and heavier sail, and it gets hoisted easily in seconds (literally) to the mast top, then tightened by winch. I had the same positive and negative experience on my last boat, and the commonality is that the difficult sails were fully battened, and the easy sails were not so. Basically the battens introduce horizontal loads onto the plastic slides which makes them bind in the mast slot. Generally the headboard has a outward load on it from the leech doing the same binding in the mast slot, but the opposite direction. The entire effect is a squeeking and screeching mainsail hoist, taking a good number of minutes. I have checked with my local North sailmaker who will happy modify my sail with roller-batten-cars which will sort the problem, for about the same price as a new sail. Not quite, but you get my point, incredibly expensive. I have pondered about taking out the full battens, just to see how that helps. Have also pondered a single roller-batten-car only for the headboard. On my last boat I soaked the mast groove in special Teflon / PTFE spray, which helped for about a day. Any other good ideas / experience / thoughts. Edited by Popeye - 02 October 2006 at 21:40
	Popeye the sailorman

Lucinda Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Joined: 26 September 2006 Location: Chad Status: Offline Points: 33	Post Options Post Reply Quote Lucinda Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 01:18
	Popeye I have the electric winch so I didn't have a problem raising the main but it was a little difficult to take down. I used a product called Fluid Film, its lanolin based and seems to stay around for months.
	Plastic King

iatista Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Sub Lieutenant Joined: 14 September 2006 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 8	Post Options Post Reply Quote iatista Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 03:19
	The same thing with the mainsail on our Hanse 411. It was not possible to raise the sail any higher than halfway without using the winch. I changed the battencars for roller battencars from Harken, 5 pieces (+/- Euro1500). The problem is solved with the new battencars installed. I raise the sail all the way up (at the mast) without using a winch. Robert

Hutschlange Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Commander Joined: 19 February 2006 Status: Offline Points: 51	Post Options Post Reply Quote Hutschlange Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 04:38
	On my old boat i installed a "Strong" profile with special travellers, it solved my problems for about the half price compared with rollersystem. It costs about 2000 euro for my 370e. Strong systems are uncomplicated to install and use, they also last 3-4 times as long as rollersystems. I have already bougt rollersystem (Ronstan) from the Hanseyard but since they have too much distance between the travellers i do have windvibrations in the sail (heavy) that will ruin it in one season. The sail is on its way back to Germany as an reclamation.

371-#235 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 14 February 2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 272	Post Options Post Reply Quote 371-#235 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 04:57
	Popeye, Sounds like something is wrong. It could be you have too much batten tension or something is wrong with the luff groove in the mast. Also, you could try cleaning the luff groove with a cleaner /lubricant system like McLube from Harken. I can raise the main on my 371 in seconds effortlessly by jumping it at the mast and temporarily clating it in a large Harken cam cleat until I take up the slack from the cockpit. In my opinion the battcar or roller slide system is nice but expensive and not needed. Bob 371-#235

Stephen Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Joined: 23 November 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 42	Post Options Post Reply Quote Stephen Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 07:28
	Hi all On the 411 sail training boat the main was hell to raise unless you slightly raised the boom. I also lubricated the mast groove this summer and the main can now be 'pumped' by hand with final tension taken by winch. No worse than other mains to raise of similar size. Not planing to change to roller sliders as they easily break and are expensive, On the Elan 431 owner installed roller sliders but have it made no real difference other then breaking on charter. Sorry, but best accept it can be hard work to hoist a North sail main. Stephen
	Stephen Kerr

Abstinenz Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List myHanse Moderator - Denmark Joined: 27 May 2006 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 563	Post Options Post Reply Quote Abstinenz Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 07:31
	Check the hallyard angel from the lock to the winch (there must not be an hallyard angel). Greifswald has a tendency to choose a lock to farr rigth from the winch when rigging the boats.

colincooper Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Rear Admiral Joined: 23 October 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 562	Post Options Post Reply Quote colincooper Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 07:36
	Very interesting discussion. The standard 370 sail is hard to raise and drop. It is one of the few things that requires leaving the cockpit to haul it down - and so a safety issue for short-handed sailing. An electric winch would help going up - but not coming down. I'd be very interested to hear from more that have solved this. The primary cause would seem to be the fully battened main. This is a big plus for speed so only a small downside for the gain. The Harken battencars solution needs a track fitting. A full solution but expensive - especially to retro-fit. The Strong sail track fits to the standard mast (effectively a low-friction plastic insert). Can be easily self-fitted. Any others? Is it worth trying lubricants in the slot? Lastly, I've thought of fixing a rope to the main hailard before hauling that could be pulled to get the main down again. Has anyone tried this? I've never seen anyone else do it and I presume it would flap and get in the way whilst sailing. So, haven't tried it yet.
	Colin (owner of Hilde - a 370)

Stephen Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Joined: 23 November 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 42	Post Options Post Reply Quote Stephen Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 07:45
	Hi all, just one more point on main hoist. Sometimes its possible to twist round the topping lift and main halyard. This means that main goes up ok to about 2 spreader then becomes very hard to near impossible needing two persons to hoist. We had this happen on the training boat and took me several minutes to resolve. Thought the halyard sheeve had burst. Stephen.
	Stephen Kerr

Popeye Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 12 September 2005 Location: Mongolia Status: Offline Points: 322	Post Options Post Reply Quote Popeye Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 03 October 2006 at 07:57
	Some comments to various posts. Lubricant = tried that on previous boat, didn't help more than a few days Batten tension = well observed, I have adjusted that, now spot on, but didn't help at all Halyard angle = well observed, was routed wrongly by the dealer out of the mast and into the first turning block, I spotted it on handover and got it fixed General = even jumping it at the mast doesn't help (i.e. removing the friction of various blocks, jammer and the self tailer) No battens = has anyone tried the difference without the battens, just to test 'Strong' sail slides = can someone send me a link / web address Edited by Popeye - 03 October 2006 at 08:00
	Popeye the sailorman



Welcome to myHanse.com the forum for Hanse Yachts owners throughout the world.