myHanse.com - Hanse Yacht Owners Website myHanse.com - Hanse Yacht Owners Website myHanse.com - Hanse Yacht Owners Website myHanse.com - Hanse Yacht Owners Website

Welcome to myHanse.com the forum for Hanse Yachts owners throughout the world.

Forum Home Forum Home > Hints & Tips > 370 / 375
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Keel Bolts
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Keel Bolts

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
Papalangi View Drop Down
Sub Lieutenant
Sub Lieutenant
Avatar

Joined: 08 October 2009
Location: Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 4
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papalangi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Keel Bolts
    Posted: 31 May 2025 at 07:02

Dear All,

I have a Hanse 370e built in 2007 and the long keel version with 1,90m draft.

Does aynbody know who much torque is needed to check the keel bolts inside the boat?

I asked alredy the designer Judel & Vrolik and he has sent me the ISO norm

I am still lost because I dont know the difference between SS 50 and SS 80 in torque and dont know what SS materila Hanse Yachts used for the upper keel bolts. I have the drawing from the lower section of the keel lead bulb / steel fin but not the upper drawing steel fin / hull.

Any help/advice is highly appreciated.

Klaus

 

Back to Top
Captain Cook View Drop Down
Admiral
Admiral
Avatar

Joined: 23 May 2006
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 1245
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Captain Cook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 2025 at 08:51
I have owned my H400 for 19 years now, and I never tried to check the torque. The obvious reason being that the size of the tool needed for doing this does not fit in my toolbox. If you had purchased a Bavaria, you might be able to check the bolts with standard DIY tools, but this is a Hanse, where the keel bolts are of substantial size. 
I very much doubt if you have tools in your workshop of the size needed.
https://hanse.boatoon.com/en/search?order=score&p=1&search=keel




Freya H400 #27 (2006),2-cabin, 40HP 3JH4E, 3-blade Flexofold, Aries LiftUp Windvane, Exturn 300, Jefa DD1,Simrad NX40,Icom M603(VHF)+M802(SSB)
Back to Top
DJgun View Drop Down
Captain
Captain
Avatar

Joined: 04 April 2020
Location: SydneyAustralia
Status: Offline
Points: 287
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DJgun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 June 2025 at 09:49
Captain Cook is correct that it is unlikely you can achieve the required torque with normal workshop tools.

The required torque  depends on more than just stud material and size.
Normally the required torque also needs to take into account...

A. The material strength of the material holding the stud. In this case we know it is cast iron, but we don't know what strength grade that is.
B. Compressive strength of the intermediate  material. This will depend on whether it is solid fibreglass, or cored, and whether polyester/epoxy/vinyl ester etc.
C. The required preloads to ensure  anticipated static and dynamic loads are achieved.

As the only people who know the answers to A, B, and C are the yacht designers they should have calculated the required torques on the keel bolts, and they shoukd specify the torques.

I can warn you that you should NOT use published values for bolts of a specific grade and size, as it will be too much for sure and possibly cause damage. These published industrial values are generally based on threads into steel, with steel in compression from the bolt. I have designed many hundreds of compression joints, (some transmitting 1,000,000+ Nm torque and massive bending moments at the same time), so I advise caution.

My memory is telling me the bolts and nuts are galvanised steel, not stainless steel.  For a given required pre-tension the torque required varies a lot, depending on whether precision marine threads/commercial grade/ Zn plated/hot-dip galvanised  and whether they are old or not. If checking joints which are now dry, the torque will be much higher than if they were oiled at assembly.  A few quick calculations show the M42 required pretension is less than about 80kN, to resist righting moment and weight on that short keel. With oiled and galvanised bolt probably 1200Nm torque would be enough.  But, the yacht designer should do an accurate calculation and advise suitable tightening torques.



 

Cheers, DJ



Edited by DJgun - 01 June 2025 at 11:03
DJ.....Sailor Ordinaire
HIN DE-HANJ0331J708
Back to Top
Papalangi View Drop Down
Sub Lieutenant
Sub Lieutenant
Avatar

Joined: 08 October 2009
Location: Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 4
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papalangi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 June 2025 at 13:51
Dear DJ and Captain Cook,

thanks for you feedback and highly appreciated. I agrree with your feedback and will not touch the keel bolts. As you said I have also have not the right size torque wrench. 
I have been in contact of the designer Judel&Vrolik but they have sent me only the ISO Norm 12215-9 which doesnt really help. I need to get hold of some of the old Hanse engineers because they are the only one who should now. 
So far not much luck to get feedback from Hanse Yacht.
I want to sell my boat and just waiting for the question from the surveyor if the keel bolts were cheked. 
Thanks again for your feedback. 
Papalangi


Back to Top
alettaenmarcel View Drop Down
Admiral
Admiral
Avatar

Joined: 15 August 2006
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 1246
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote alettaenmarcel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 June 2025 at 19:55
I have our 370 also since 2006 and never thought off checking the keel bolts on its tork.
But it should also not be nessesery because the complete system is in polyester resin. I have seen how once a keel was remover from a Hanse in Norway ( YouTube) and it lasted a few days before it was separate from the hull.
So I will not do anything with it , only wenn I have to because i have hit something underwater.
Gr Marcel


Edited by alettaenmarcel - 06 June 2025 at 19:56
Kids Dingys 72-79 ,Several Windsurfboards 79-86 OK dingy competitions 86-92 , Trotter Pandora Race 92-98, Friendship 28 Sport 98-05, Hanse 370 06-......
Back to Top
Papalangi View Drop Down
Sub Lieutenant
Sub Lieutenant
Avatar

Joined: 08 October 2009
Location: Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 4
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papalangi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2025 at 17:33
Hi Marcel,

thanks for your feedback. I found some old e-mail correspondence with Hanse Yacht from 2007 and for the M30 Torque is 294NM and for the M42 Torque is 815 NM but mentioned the the torque is only a guide number. So lets hope no grounding for the future.
BR Klaus
Back to Top
DJgun View Drop Down
Captain
Captain
Avatar

Joined: 04 April 2020
Location: SydneyAustralia
Status: Offline
Points: 287
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DJgun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 June 2025 at 23:49
Thanks Klaus,
Those torque seem to be quite realistic, and achievable using hand tools.
They are a little lower than I expected, but not a concern.

I had a shipwright try and undo one of the nuts to my 400e a few years ago and with a 2m long bar, and all his strength he couldn't undo it. From his strength I'm guessing that was well over 1500nm, but that is the nature of bolts which are tightened already. We left the keel in place...
DJ.....Sailor Ordinaire
HIN DE-HANJ0331J708
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.06
Copyright ©2001-2023 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.098 seconds.

Links : www.hanseyachts.co.uk www.hanseyachts.com www.fjordboats.co.uk www.dehler.co.uk www.varianta.co.uk