Rudder removal

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   I have our 2005 H371 on the hard now, and wanted to drop the rudder for inspection. The rudder does not have excessive play so I do not expect to replace parts. Just inspect, clean and re-install.
Having read through all rudder-removal-threads on this forum, I was prepared for some form of brute force being required to whack the rudderstock out of the Lewmar top bearing. 

I just can't get it to budge, and am concerned that even more force will ruin the bearing race. I have contacted Jefa for advice and got this response:
"No other way to do it. You need to bang the bearings out with a lot of force by means of wooden logs and a hammer (see picture – just for understanding) – the bearings will break, but that’s the only way to remove them now."
Added to the above was a quote for a new top bearing (€481 + VAT + shipping).

Does anybody know of any miracle-working-tips on how to drop the rudder without needing to replace the top bearing? If not, I will just leave the rudder where it is. 

Edited by martijnvdh - 30 October 2023 at 08:59

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martijnvdh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Commander Joined: 25 August 2021 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 110	Post Options Post Reply Quote martijnvdh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Rudder removal Posted: 30 October 2023 at 07:59
	I have our 2005 H371 on the hard now, and wanted to drop the rudder for inspection. The rudder does not have excessive play so I do not expect to replace parts. Just inspect, clean and re-install. Having read through all rudder-removal-threads on this forum, I was prepared for some form of brute force being required to whack the rudderstock out of the Lewmar top bearing. I just can't get it to budge, and am concerned that even more force will ruin the bearing race. I have contacted Jefa for advice and got this response: "No other way to do it. You need to bang the bearings out with a lot of force by means of wooden logs and a hammer (see picture – just for understanding) – the bearings will break, but that’s the only way to remove them now." Added to the above was a quote for a new top bearing (€481 + VAT + shipping). Does anybody know of any miracle-working-tips on how to drop the rudder without needing to replace the top bearing? If not, I will just leave the rudder where it is. Edited by martijnvdh - 30 October 2023 at 08:59

Koppiekrou Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 21 February 2018 Location: The Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 185	Post Options Post Reply Quote Koppiekrou Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 30 October 2023 at 11:38
	We have dropped the rudder in 2018. Our H371 is also from 2005 and the lower bearing was done. We’ve broke the lower bearing to lower the rudder. In 2022 we dropped the rudder again to be able to fix some cracks on top of the rudder. Indeed we used a lot of force. You need a piece of tropical wood. Then all the energy will be used to get de rudderstock out of the top bearing. Believe me, you will need a big hammer, some soap and a lot of force. Nothing breaks and finally the rudder will drop. Good luck and if needed you can call me. Please send a PM for my tel.number. Frank
	291 4Ever - 341 Eternal Flame and now a Hanse 371 '05 Karma - Shoal draft - 2 cabin - 40hp - Variprofile

martijnvdh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Commander Joined: 25 August 2021 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 110	Post Options Post Reply Quote martijnvdh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 30 October 2023 at 13:37
	Thanks Frank, gives me a bit more confidence that a bigger hammer might work I don't think our rudder has ever been dropped, so 18 years of aluminiumoxide to break loose... I sent you a PM, would be great if you can spare a few minutes for a chat!

415 Singapore Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Vice Admiral Joined: 23 September 2013 Location: Singapore Status: Offline Points: 935	Post Options Post Reply Quote 415 Singapore Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 31 October 2023 at 11:55
	Hi we dropped our Rudder last week, it certainly took a lot more brute force than I expected. Top bearing was fine, but I think we broke the bottom one on removal as light corrosion on the stock got caught on the roller bearings and broke the rather flimsy looking retaining cover. Jefa were very helpful and efficient and I got a new one in 4 days, albeit at a price! Good luck Paul
	Paul - Night Train - 415 #136

martijnvdh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Commander Joined: 25 August 2021 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 110	Post Options Post Reply Quote martijnvdh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 November 2023 at 09:21
	A small update on my progress...I gave up Remember, nothing was wrong with my steering. No excessive play or heavy steering. This is the first winter I have the boat inside a shed and thought it would be the right moment to inspect the rudder and bearings, and give it all a good clean. A good friend with a lathe made me a "special tool" to fit into the top of the rudderstock. Steering quadrant, gaiter and retaining grub screws have been removed under deck. I have hit the rudderstock with a 2kg hammer, a lot harder than I would have initially been comfortable with. I have even tried heating the top bearing to approx 40°C (rudderstock was 13°C). Not even a mm of movement. I am now convinced that a grinder will be needed to cut away the top bearing before rudder removal becomes possible. Given the fact that nothing was wrong to start with, I am going to leave it all in place, order a new gaiter and continue with all the other maintenance jobs on my list.

Jojo Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 03 August 2022 Location: liljeholmen swe Status: Offline Points: 166	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jojo Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 November 2023 at 21:19
	It looks like one of the stopping hex bolt (Allen kee) still is in the top bearing (item 11 in your chart) Did you by chance miss to use penetrating oil at the rudderstoc/bearing joints if all stoppers are removed You can spry in those holes if Allen bolts are completely removed Carefully applying that at both top and lower bearing and then let it soak for some days make wonder My tip is to tape plastic around so no oil can splash up on the teak when applying and hammering If you already have hammered on the parts my guess is that you have made some kind of damage already in the trust bearing Edited by Jojo - 13 November 2023 at 21:47
	3 Cabin, Hanse 342, Deep draft, Tiller version.

Jojo Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 03 August 2022 Location: liljeholmen swe Status: Offline Points: 166	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jojo Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 November 2023 at 22:22
	If the bolt still is present!!!! Take great care when removing the stopper hex now So the rudder freely droops to the ground when you remove it and brake It’s a two man job and it’s grate to have some padding underneath on the ground just in case
	3 Cabin, Hanse 342, Deep draft, Tiller version.

martijnvdh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Commander Joined: 25 August 2021 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 110	Post Options Post Reply Quote martijnvdh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 November 2023 at 07:58
	Unfortunately....all the grub screws are out and penetrating oil has been applied. Feedback from Jefa was that "This happens, if the last maintenance has been done a long time ago." My guess is that the rudder was never dropped in the past 18 years, and that I am the first to try. I am just not ready to cut the top bearing out and replace it. Maybe next time At least I will not have to worry about the rudder dropping out by itself... Edited by martijnvdh - 14 November 2023 at 07:59

Mark_J1 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Rear Admiral Joined: 12 March 2013 Location: Dover&Medway UK Status: Offline Points: 690	Post Options Post Reply Quote Mark_J1 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 November 2023 at 16:53
	Not quite the same setup, but my experience with a Jefa top bearing on my 2005 build 400 was similar. After removal of all retaining fasteners, the rudder post was very tough to budge. I kept dripping penetrating oil in between removal attempts (I could use oil as I was planning to replace the bottom bearing. The bottom bearing rollers are normally best lubricated with water). Kept doing that for a week. I regularly hit the top of the stock with a mallet in between other jobs. Eventually saw maybe a mm of descent but no more! On Jefa's advice I used a long wooden pole as a pry bar between hull & top of the rudder. Pole was carefully shaped to fit better. With that 2m+ leverage the rudder slid quite gently out. Patience required I guess but it's not a job for the feint hearted :) You'll see the pole technique on some of the Jefa rudder bearing removal 'how to' videos. Mark
	Hanse 400e "Grey Goose" Hull #31



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