portholes

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   Breezers,
The loss of the porthole at sea was on board Norse King, at 0100 the rest you've probably read.

It was the original that had been Sikaflex'd in rather than any mechanical joint.  Our nearest Hanse dealer Inspiration Marine had them all replaced and am pleased to report they are still water tight.  Which is more than can be said about the mast, which was un-stepped to replace a spreader and re-rigged, despite replacing the mast gaiter, it leaks like a sieve.

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JonB Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Rear Admiral Joined: 21 September 2010 Location: Cowes Status: Offline Points: 504	Post Options Post Reply Quote JonB Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 May 2013 at 14:23
	Breezers, The loss of the porthole at sea was on board Norse King, at 0100 the rest you've probably read. It was the original that had been Sikaflex'd in rather than any mechanical joint. Our nearest Hanse dealer Inspiration Marine had them all replaced and am pleased to report they are still water tight. Which is more than can be said about the mast, which was un-stepped to replace a spreader and re-rigged, despite replacing the mast gaiter, it leaks like a sieve.
	Jon B 470e http://www.norse-king.blogspot.co.uk

Breezers Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Joined: 14 August 2009 Location: Malta Status: Offline Points: 20	Post Options Post Reply Quote Breezers Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 May 2013 at 17:43
	Hello JonB, I am grateful for your story. It made me inspect my portholes with the known result. We are planning an ocean crossing, I must not think of what could have happened. The leakage around the mast is solved with Sikaflex on our boat. A simple job, but I do'nt know if we are talking about the same leakage.
	New Breeze

JonB Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Rear Admiral Joined: 21 September 2010 Location: Cowes Status: Offline Points: 504	Post Options Post Reply Quote JonB Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 May 2013 at 17:56
	Breezers, Despite all that happened, we are pleased with the boat, they sail well and are no slouchers (not slow). We always had a slight leak and when the mast came off we saw a split in the rubber, so ordered a new mast gaiter, which was fitted (I assume), when the mast was re-stepped. Now every time it rains in runs down to the bilge. I'll remove the pulley's and the top plate and see what gaps I now have that need filling/sealing. It appears to me that if you buy something new, to fit on some thing other than brand new, it's a different size or shape ! Still keeps me thinking. Have a safe trip.
	Jon B 470e http://www.norse-king.blogspot.co.uk

David Ericksson Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Sub Lieutenant Joined: 30 December 2009 Location: Stockholm Status: Offline Points: 14	Post Options Post Reply Quote David Ericksson Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 30 August 2013 at 11:26
	Hi Panos, Did you ever reflect on why the portholes came lose? My idea is that the hull is moving and bending to much and that the portholes, unlike for example in modern cars, are not intended as construction elements. Did you notice any cracks in the hull around the windows?
	David Hanse 470, Prima Donna

iemand Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admiral Joined: 13 February 2004 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 1099	Post Options Post Reply Quote iemand Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 30 August 2013 at 13:34
	The portholes where simple Plexi plates with the same problem than all the other windows and glued pieces. Only because they are vertical mounted the problem is less big (sun) BR Thomas.
	Hanse 312 MJ 2004 - Hanse 370e MJ 2007

JonB Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Rear Admiral Joined: 21 September 2010 Location: Cowes Status: Offline Points: 504	Post Options Post Reply Quote JonB Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 31 August 2013 at 10:22
	Hi, Two of the deck windows that Inspiration Marine did for me have portholes cut in them, unfortunately the plexiglass or whatever it is is suffering from cracking. This I assume is due to the holes being cut by hand rather than by laser. So IM have ordered a replacement and I shall replace them myself, without the port holes this time as not often used. We have always had good communication with the guys at IM here in the the UK.
	Jon B 470e http://www.norse-king.blogspot.co.uk

David Ericksson Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Sub Lieutenant Joined: 30 December 2009 Location: Stockholm Status: Offline Points: 14	Post Options Post Reply Quote David Ericksson Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 January 2014 at 21:10
	Correctly fitted new portholes is a "safety at sea" issue, why it is only natural that Hanse should make a general recall of all boats and pay also for professional installation of the new portholes by a local shipyard. Think of the consequences for not professionally installed portholes as given by the examples earlier in this thread.
	David Hanse 470, Prima Donna

JonB Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Rear Admiral Joined: 21 September 2010 Location: Cowes Status: Offline Points: 504	Post Options Post Reply Quote JonB Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 January 2014 at 10:37
	David, If it was simply a Hanse issue, then I'm sure that would be the case, as did the car manufacturer in America, when they discovered there was a design fault with the braking system. Hanse, Beneteau and others, have an on going case against the company that produces the bonding sealant and primer, Sika. As I understood it, they allege the product supplied is suitable but that the process of fitting the portholes was flawed. The manufacturers suggest that they can't all have got it wrong and its the product that is at fault. We the unfortunate third parties that have to deal with the potential situations. All I suggest is that you keep up a good line of communication with your local dealer & of course use the forum. And a careful eye for leaks around the units. I am still waiting for Hanse to re-supply the deck windows, that have crazed around the internal portholes fitted.
	Jon B 470e http://www.norse-king.blogspot.co.uk

Peter-Blake Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admiral of the Fleet Joined: 04 March 2008 Status: Offline Points: 2471	Post Options Post Reply Quote Peter-Blake Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 January 2014 at 11:06
	Just to keep it right! You write that the manufacturer of the failing sealant was sika! Are you absolut sure it was the company Sika? Or did you use only the word "sika" for a better understanding? My information is that in the 2008 models on delivery the yard did not use Material from the company SIKA! In the later repair Hanse used SIKA instead of the original material. Edited by Peter-Blake - 15 January 2014 at 11:07
	Blake 370

panos Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admiral Joined: 02 March 2008 Status: Offline Points: 1939	Post Options Post Reply Quote panos Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 January 2014 at 11:27
	There are several problems with the hull windows: 1) they were out of acryl, a plastic material with a huge thermal expansion coefficient. The windows exerted a shearing force to the rubber/glue/SIKA whatever it was 2) the black substance Hanse used to attach the windows was not very stable and had no UV protection. After two three years it became brittle 3) they used the wrong or bad quality primer 4) they most probably didn't follow the installation procedure in the factory Result: after only one year we almost lost one of the port windows and took two tons of seawater. The batteries were replaced under guaranty and all the hull windows were rebeded by a local craftsman under Hanse supervision. He did a much better job than the factory because the portholes lasted two years this time. Of course now that I new the problem I inspected them at regular intervals and rebeded some myself. After considerable pressure Hanse changed the acrylic with a high strength glass everywhere! After two years we have no problems, but my next boat will not have hull windows.
	Panos Hanse 630e - selling her -



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