I put my hand up and around the side of the port ceiling panel, and felt drips of water on the bolts.. I undid the screws holding the left ceiling panel on, hoping to slid it out, so I could get at the toe rail bolts on the inside..but alas the ceiling panel would not slide out.. 

Question - Do I need to take the centre panel out , it means cutting seal around the hatch, or do all three panels need to come out..?

As I understand there are no nuts.

it could be that the fixation resulted in a "cold bridge". If it is cold outside and warmer humid air inside you might get some drips on from the metal plate.

 

Good Luck

Frank

 

 

I don't know about the set up of navigation lights on your H301. However I had a similar problem on my H400e. I found that seawater was being forced into the holes where the 12v wires to the lights exit in the pulpit stanchions (ie on which the navigation lights were fixed). An application of silicone sealant sorted the problem immediately - no more trickles down the wood panelling in heavy seas/spray etc. A very easy fix. It may be worth considering this before starting any "major surgery". 

Good luck & best wishes

Richard

We have had  a similar problem on our 301. 

The most likely offender is the seal of the port side rear pulpit leg. It has leaked a lot in the past on our boat.  Make sure this is well sealed.  One little nut and it can be lifted use a very flexible sealant. 

It could possibly be the sealing of the bow cleat if this has been subject to some energetic tugging on a mooring. 

Also Check that the drain for the anchor locker is kept clear.  Ours was filling up and a small leak occurred into the bow via the conduit for the navigation light as the cable comes out in the anchor locker on the port side. 

It is highly unlikely to be the toe rail bolts or the seal between deck and hull unless you have bumped it very hard at some time at that point. 

There is no need to remove any linings to get access.... If you do want to the way to remove them is to cut sealant around  escape hatch and unscrew all self tappers on centre one and remove this. Then you can remove the port side one to gain a better view of the area you are concerned about. The starboard side needs the water fill pipe dropping off the deck filler before it can be removed.

I did all this over winter and filled all the voids behind the  panels with aluminium bubble foil insulation stuck to the deck head and to the panels. I want to insulate the hull sides now as we get bad condensation on the wood veneer especially with cold water on the outside. 

Steve

thanks again guys, much appreciated..

Always assumed it was port rear pulpit bolt but every time I have put my hand up there to feel it it has been dry as a bone.

Also concluded the centre panel needs to come out to get at it thus meaning a reseal job on the hatch so more work than worth it.

It’s a minor issue which had damaged the woodwork before I bought the boat and it’s not got appreciably worse so has forever been on the long list. Interesting that there might be a simple solution from on deck.

Part of my stalling is because tapping the ply lining indicates the wood is lying against the hull at that exact point and I can’t rule out condensation damage which would be a bigger fix (headliners out and a new ply lining battened off the hull).

Does anyone know if there was actually a sealant originally used between the bottom of the toe rail and outer deck surface?  It does not appear to me that there was any sealant used there during assembly.  There is no indication of sealant squeezing out from under the toe rail at any point on my boat.

If that is true, it would seem the source of any leaks now most likely are thru the toe rail screw holes themselves...in other words, leaking down the threads themselves.  After much troubleshooting, that is the conclusion I am coming to on my boat.  The water appears drip off the screws to run down the interior of the hull onto a horizontal reinforcement rib behind the liner panel until it finds a low spot to then run down further where the hull is bonded to the vee berth horizontal platform.  At this point it wets the liner panel as it pools up.

I am considering backing out each toe rail screw one at a time partially, applying sealant to the exposed threads, and then immediately driving the screw back down.  By removing them one at a time, I hope to not disturb the bonded deck/hull joint that might occur if several adjacent screws are removed to lift the toe rail to inject sealant under the toe rail.

Any thoughts?

Yes I had similar problem, and the toe rail is on self tapping screws with a couple of bolts on fairleadsand stantion base.  I had a leaky section and managed, with struggle, and modified tool to fit bolts washers and nuts and clamp up the toe rail tight in the area of leak. Took time and inginuity to start nuts, and in one difficult area used a drilled and tapped 5mm thick by 22mm wide strip of Stainless to act as two nut where I couldnt get in to hold nuts.

Good luck.

I have still not found a way to access those bow cleat nuts which were obviously installed on the deck before the deck was mated to the hull. (Photos from fabrication confirm the cleats are installed in this sequence).  On my boat, hex head bolts are recessed into the top of the cleat, with nuts under the deck, so removal requires access below the deck.

For now, I have stopped the leak by applying sealant around the exterior base of the cleat, and a little around the top of the bolt head recessed into the cleat.  Not a great solution.  Ultimately I believe I will have to locate and cut access holes in the forward cabin ceiling liner to access and remove the nuts to allow me to properly remove and re-bed the bow cleats.

Very frustrating

Mike

Commiserations  Mike,

my last post on this subject was a leak  on my H301[ 2000]; Currently I have just found first leak on my 315 [2007] and again toe rail self tapping screws problems. So hard to  get at and access!.

I have managed to sort; but I went round the toerail and found nearly all the self tapping screws would take a 1/4 to 1/2 turn to tighten.  Looking to future I guess I need to put in order for 50 plus countersunk M5 or M6 screws nuts and washers, access will be the problem, but any deck leak causes the headlining damage and deteriation, it has to be fixed.

Back in 1975 my first yacht a racing 1/4 tonner a David Thomas Quarto design, nearly finished my yachting. The design was for a light weight build, early use of balsa deck core and David though he could get away with telf tapping screw deck to hull joint and he used T section Aluminium bolted thru the deck to takechain plate load. On my first sail from Thames to home port of Langstone, upwind in a rough English Channel the Nav lights failed and we had leaks that need bilge pumping every 30 mins. I survived the night and in daylight found the deck was pulling off the hull. I subsequently bolted down deck and put in a bulkhead to transfer the chain plate loads to rhe hull. David was not responsible for the srew joint problem it was a shortcut by the builder who subsequenly went bust.

 David Thomas  became a friend and neighbour, advising and helping me successfully modify my yachts to win races. David was a world class prolific designer many great yachts came from his drawing board. I note that those early self tapping screws were really meant for sheet metal, the screwsbused by Hanse are specifically designed for GRP. Call me ''old fashioned'' but I think bolts and nuts are my preferred fixing for deck to hull joints.

Perry