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hedegaard 
Sub Lieutenant 
Joined: 03 June 2010 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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 Posted: 23 November 2010 at 08:22 |
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Hi Steve
Thanks for your interesting input. When you say, that you got a gauge and tensioned to reccommended figures, was these figures also beyond 25 % breaking strengh of the wire. Hedegaard |
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Rubato
Admiral 
Joined: 12 July 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1806 |
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Posted: 23 November 2010 at 18:29 |
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Not initially Hedegaard. I used the North guide when I first got the gauge which, if I remember correctly, set it around 20% or a bit more.... However, I've tightened further since and am around 25% or a bit more.
Steve
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hedegaard
Sub Lieutenant
Joined: 03 June 2010 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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Posted: 23 November 2010 at 21:39 |
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Hi Steve
That sounds like a resonable tension, tight but not beyond out of limit. I spoke today with a rigging company in Sweden and they were totally in line with your opinion, 20 -25 % on V1. I find it quite risky, that North Sails publish a Video, telling to go so far above the 25 %, more like 35 %, but they don`t acknowledge the problem. Steve, thanks for your response, a big help. Jørgen Hedegaard |
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silversailor
Admiral
Joined: 25 May 2005 Location: South Haven, MI Status: Offline Points: 1021 |
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Posted: 25 August 2016 at 15:03 |
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I've been frustrated by the inability of my H-370 to point higher. This discussion came up on a Google search and I would like to revive it. I sail my boat similarly to Steve: cruise, buoy and distance races. I set my rig up using the "lower" settings recommended by some owners. Today, I'm going to change to the "higher" settings, close to those recommended by North. Additionally, I would appreciate comments regarding your experiences with rig settings, forestay length, etc.
Many thanks. |
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Silversailor
South Haven, MI USA S/V Legacy 2010 Andrews 28 |
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SamsonII
Lieutenant Commander 
Joined: 19 July 2016 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 70 |
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Posted: 26 August 2016 at 06:56 |
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Hi,
After taking over my new (to me!) boat in late june this year i realized that there where not enough tension in the rig. When I first sailed the boat the top of the mast fell out, and the lower shrouds where dangling arount like loose rope! I took the boat to North Sails in Oslo, and they adjusted the rig (one of their not-so-experienced-riggers...) The intermediate shrouds where to tight he said, and the lower to loose. When I did the test sail I felt the rig still was way to loose, and both intermediate and lower shrouds became loose from 7-8 knots. I called North again, and they apologized for the poor work done during the summer, and have promised to have another look at the boat next week. They said that the Hanse 370 is a tricky boat when it comes to adjusting the rig, with a very narrow "envelope" where the rig is correctly set. I will keep you posted after they av readjusted the rig neext week. As it is set up right now it does not point as I would expect at all (my old Bavaria 32 AC was pointing higher!)
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Stein-Erik Carlsen
Hanse 370e 2006 #41 "Samson II" |
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silversailor
Admiral
Joined: 25 May 2005 Location: South Haven, MI Status: Offline Points: 1021 |
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Posted: 26 August 2016 at 14:51 |
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Stein-Erik, make sure that the rigger gives you the numbers that he tuned too. Otherwise, you will not be able to recreate the tuning if it works well for you. Many riggers tune by "feel." The North tuning guide calls for the Uppers to be tightened to "40" using a Loos PT-3M devise. However, on the Loos devise the range above 34 (for 8mm cables) is not defined since it exceeds 25% (the generally recommended maximum breaking strength). I tuned my Uppers to 25% breaking strength; my Lowers to 11%; Mid to 11%, in my attempt to convert the table on the Loos PT-3M devise to my non-metric Loos. Sailed last night but conditions were sloppy (light shifting winds and consistent rollers) so I really could not fully judge the effect of my tuning.
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Silversailor
South Haven, MI USA S/V Legacy 2010 Andrews 28 |
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mopoulter
Captain 
Joined: 19 March 2009 Location: London, Canada Status: Offline Points: 320 |
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Posted: 26 August 2016 at 15:45 |
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Those North tensions are much too high I have no idea how they were arrived at. I have a long story that I will keep short. I had Hans Fogh (Olympic medallist many time world champion sailor) race with me one day on my 370. He got on a re-tensioned the rig by feel. He tuned it very light. I recorded the tension with my Loos gage PT-3M and next year set boat up accordingly. In light air everything was O.K. In > 12 knots I was tacking through 110 degrees. We tightened rigging 21 uppers, 19 mids and 16 lowers I might be losing some performance in light air (don't know) but in > 12 up to 25 I tack through 90 no sweat (from 30 AWA to 30 AWA). Moral of story light is fine in light air but higher tension is required for > 12 and < 12 high tension does not seem to make you suffer too much although I have never done the direct comparison.
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mp
Hanse 370 #416 "Anxiolytic" |
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Rubato
Admiral
Joined: 12 July 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1806 |
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Posted: 26 August 2016 at 16:45 |
Hey Mike, if the numbers that you mention you ended up at are % of breaking strength, I don't think you're that far off the North numbers in the end are you? a few percent lower perhaps - not sure as I don't know the 370 cable dimensions and the North guide gives Loos gauge readings not % of breaking strength. A few % here and there aren't a big deal IMO. The real take away for me is that most "everyday riggers" really set things up loose. The traditional wisdom of "crank on backstay" to get less forestay sag (for better point when the breeze builds) doesn't work well on the type of rig we have. The only thing that really controls head stay sag are the cap shrouds so they need to be cranked on darn tight. The other thing that really helps point is mast rake. So try to get close to the forestay length that North recommends.
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Steve
Hanse 400e, #168 |
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mopoulter
Captain
Joined: 19 March 2009 Location: London, Canada Status: Offline Points: 320 |
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Posted: 26 August 2016 at 17:26 |
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The numbers I gave are the readings on gauge not % breaking strength. I may have mis remembered the model I have. My re-collection is that the North numbers have you tensioning up around 35% using my gauge so I just figured it out myself.
As for back stay tension I do put some on (how much I can't tell you) This is by feel for me but it does bend the mast. In order to get bend I was told by Hans Fogh the lowers should be relatively loose this permits the mast to bend. Again I can't verify anything as I work for a living  and can't spend all my time testing all the permutations of rig adjustments. Without sounding arrogant I hope our up-hill performance is pretty good I am killing boat for boat a C&C 41 (PHRF 82) these days. Although I can't seem to get another boat which corrects ahead of me (their PHRF is 180!!!). I will stop whining I am going to boat today to check rig as I am racing this Sunday and I did notice a bias on one tack over another.
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mp
Hanse 370 #416 "Anxiolytic" |
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mopoulter
Captain
Joined: 19 March 2009 Location: London, Canada Status: Offline Points: 320 |
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Posted: 29 August 2016 at 17:05 |
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So I have PT-3 my tension are 21 uppers, 17 mids and 15 lowers.
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mp
Hanse 370 #416 "Anxiolytic" |
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mopoulter wrote: