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H418 motor starter burned

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TouchOfGrey View Drop Down
Sub Lieutenant
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Joined: 16 March 2018
Location: Netherlands
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TouchOfGrey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: H418 motor starter burned
    Posted: 16 November 2019 at 17:35
Hi GoodCompany,

my new motorstarter has kept up good since the replacement. It's not a Hitachi starter (originally used by Hanse) but a more affordable imitation. So far so good. The mechanic doing the replacement could not find spark marks, cable damage or other reasons that could have cause the failure. Last week the local Yanmar service mechanic did the motor service and looked at the starter situation as well. Could not find a definite root cause either.

There are three hypothesis:
1. someone accidentally pressed the 'start' button while the engine was already running, the starter failed to disengage and consequently it burned.
2. The starter failed to disengage after I started the engine and during the 1,5-2 hours running at 2500 rpm it managed to survive, after increasing rev's to 3500 it burned up.
3. The cable/lug moved somewhat cause by waves/swell and touched the next connector, despite we didn't find spark marks.

My follow up actions:
1. we install a protective ss cover over the motor panel buttons to prevent accidentally pressing any button.
2. can't do anything about this. After replacing the starter we opened the motor area when starting the engine to listen for confirmation that the starter disengaged and slowed down to zero revís. I can't hear it from the cockpit. Since the event the current starter had no issues and it built enough trust so we lately stopped this verification.
3. Hanse uses very large cables, heavy and difficult to bend in a way it clears the other connector well. Since there are several other, smaller, cables connected to the same connection, the 'outer' lug is over the barrier between the connectors. Thus when that cable/lug rotates, it may make contact with the other connector. To reduce/avoid this risk, I'm contemplating to bring the various smaller cables together in another way and then connect these with only one cable to the motor starter. That way we reduce the number of lugs on one starter connector. 

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Goodcompany View Drop Down
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Joined: 02 November 2019
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goodcompany Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 November 2019 at 00:40
Hi touch of grey. 
We had the same experience with our 418. Our  startmotor has been replaced twice. First time it didn't start at all, without any signs of burnings whatsoever. It just went broke. Second time we were just a few minutes on our way when we noticed a burning smell. Turned out that the startmotor died again. Yanmar told us that its probably a cable problem but they have  to investigate. Do you have already new insights?
Edwin
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Antsy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Antsy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 October 2019 at 05:52
My starter has just failed / Burnt out.  I thought this only happened to other people.  Haven't had a problem until last weekend.  They are going to fit a controls guard but I don't think it is caused by that
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Muriel View Drop Down
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Joined: 19 February 2019
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Muriel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2019 at 12:27
Hi Peter,
No I don't.  Windcraft just did it as part of the Commissioning process back in April this year and really only talked about it at handover.  I think they designed and made it themselves, but can't be sure.  It was about the same time the reports had come through of multiple burnouts of starter motors and they were just taking precautions to remove all risks of someone accidentally leaning on the button, which they felt was a bit exposed.

If you email Windcraft Service I'm sure they can clarify for you.

Where about in Sydney are you?
Cheers
Bruce J
If you don't know where you are going, how will you know when you get there?

Muriel 418 #081
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P&J View Drop Down
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Joined: 07 February 2019
Location: Greece
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote P&J Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2019 at 12:16
Hi Bruce,
Do you know where your dealer sourced the stainless steel frame as I would like to purchase one for our 418.
I live in Sydney
Best regards
Peter
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TouchOfGrey View Drop Down
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Joined: 16 March 2018
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TouchOfGrey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 September 2019 at 08:07
hi guys,

Triggered by the story of Bruce I'd asked Windcraft what exactly they install to protect the motor panel buttons. Richard kindly send the following response: "We do indeed fit a stainless steel protection bar to the Yanmar panel. These are manufactured here for each boat. I have attached a photograph of one we have installed for your reference."

Happy sailing,

Henk 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote S&J Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 August 2019 at 23:03
Hmm.  As a part time Aussie I'm envious of Breath being in tropical waters.  Many happy memories cruising the Whitsundays on a charter yacht, long before I owned my own boat.
We got hammered today with 30+ over the decks and somewhat inexperienced crew so didn't even get as far as Yarmouth, which was our intended destination.  However just spent a great evening exchanging sailing stories in one of the restaurants in Cowes.
Wishing you all fair winds and safe passages.
H385 #351 Ningaloo UK south coast; Scotland 2020?
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Tranquillity View Drop Down
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Joined: 01 December 2018
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tranquillity Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 August 2019 at 21:40
Gordon.

You have a stunning location, we visited a couple of years ago and loved the area!  Lots of fond Oz memories!

As a contrast this weekend in Yarmouth a small pretty harbour off Isle of Wight but UK weather blowing and a very cold wind!!

Thanks for pics and advice, will get our control cables wrapped in a spiral conduit as can see the benefit.

G'day and enjoy those beautiful  islandsTongue

Jon.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Breathe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 August 2019 at 10:38
Jon,

Ours was wrapped in tape, that did not provide adequate protection when the loom rubbed on something near the engine, probably a bolt. See photos below. My new loom has been installed in split conduit.

This thread has made me spend to much time remembering one of lifeís really bad experiences.....

On the other hand, we had a great sail today, a nice long reach in 15 knots of tropical wind, Breathe doing what she was purchased to do. We are cruising the east coast of Australia, currently in the Whitsunday Islands, arguably Australiaís premier cruising location. We are here until the end of September,  then time to head home.

Gordon


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tranquillity Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2019 at 22:52
Gordon. 

Many thanks, very helpful. Did a quick check and all looks ok, wrapped tightly in tape and no damage but will do a detailed inspection. Appreciated the detailed feedback.

Good sailing.

Jon
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