Traveler effectiveness

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   My 320 has a huge 6ft traveler installed by previous owner. I've been sailing my boat for now 3 years and almost never used the traveler. 99% of the time I ease or trim with the mainsheet. Occasional exception is when I need to move the boom to the center.
How is your experience with using the traveler? I'm considering either removing it completely or reducing to the shorter one to install closer to the floor instead of on top of the seats.

Val

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SailCS33 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 October 2019 Location: New Jersey, US Status: Offline Points: 188	Post Options Post Reply Quote SailCS33 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Traveler effectiveness Posted: 17 July 2023 at 20:31
	My 320 has a huge 6ft traveler installed by previous owner. I've been sailing my boat for now 3 years and almost never used the traveler. 99% of the time I ease or trim with the mainsheet. Occasional exception is when I need to move the boom to the center. How is your experience with using the traveler? I'm considering either removing it completely or reducing to the shorter one to install closer to the floor instead of on top of the seats. Val
	H320 "Curacao", Hull #085, 2008

perry Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 13 October 2015 Location: IOW Status: Offline Points: 318	Post Options Post Reply Quote perry Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 July 2023 at 08:27
	Hi, what can I say? the previous owner knew what he was doing; Such a full length traveller is essential to get the best out of a yacht with a relatively large main sail. You need to get to grips with sal trim. Consider:- The wind does not move at constant velocity from sea level to top of your mast. Both speed and apparent angle change. To enable the best efficiency of the aerofoil sections of your sail the angle of attack has to be varied up the sail [sail twist]. The angles depend also on the net wind speed. For example in light wind you should ease the clew outhaul to allow a deep section near bottom of sail, and ease the vang and the main halyard and the backstay to allow the sail it maximum depth of aerofoil sections, it should twist off towards top, then observing the telltails modify the setting to get good flow over all sail. The full width traveler is used to set the angle of boom. I strengthening wind the controls move towards flattening the sail, clew outhaul tension, main halyard tension, tension backstay to bend mast flatten top of sail. As wind speed increases, you get to stage of flatest unreefed main, halyard tight, backstay hard on approx mast bent to approx 1.5/1.8 X thickness of mast, clew outhaul flatest setting. at this stage you will need to drop the traveller down in gusts, and pull it up in the lulls. This stage will be top of force 3 or low force 4. Next you should put in first reef, ensure sail is well reefed with the reef line tension flattening the sail. So please start using your sail controls and you will find the full width traveler is essential part of sailing well. I have a preference to setup the vang so it lifts the boom, and a cascaded vang tackle allows me to put twist in sail in very light ghosting winds when the weight of boom alone pulls out any twist. Others use the topping lift. Backstay tension/mast bend is best achieved by hand with a cascaded system, the block system supplied is inadequate Mainsail sheeting is improved with fast and slow systems to improve control. Try searching my old threadson main sheet, for sme photos easier than explaination. There is lots of sail trim information available: I dont claim to be the expert but I have occasionaly won races. Now 78 yrs young I cruise, but my love of sailing 'better' I cant let go. Perry East Cowes UK Yacht Bloto-4 H315 [2007]
	Current Yacht Hanse 315 2007 Last Yacht Hanse 301 Round GB in 2017

samuel Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admiral of the Fleet Joined: 26 December 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 2770	Post Options Post Reply Quote samuel Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 July 2023 at 08:30
	On my 311 I use it all the time to control twist when closer to the wind. Off the wind I move it to one side to keep it clear of my tiller. In light airs I sometimes have the car up wind a small amount. I sometimes use it to dampen a gybe. I often use the traveller, instead of the sheet, to play the main if carrying too much sail, in gusts
	Daydream Believer- Hanse 311- No GBR9917T- Bradwell Essex

Forth2 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Commander Joined: 23 October 2016 Location: Finland Status: Offline Points: 77	Post Options Post Reply Quote Forth2 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 July 2023 at 11:11
	I removed the traveller from my H315 -06. I never used it and it was just uncomfortable on the topside of the benches.I control the mainsail twist by having a strong vang boom that can adjust the height of the main boom. In order to better reach the main sheet from behind the wheel I made this solution. Edited by Forth2 - 18 July 2023 at 11:17

SailCS33 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 October 2019 Location: New Jersey, US Status: Offline Points: 188	Post Options Post Reply Quote SailCS33 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 July 2023 at 12:25
	Thank you all that replied. I believe my question was misunderstood by some people. I do use sail controls extensively. My question was specifically about the effectiveness of the 6ft traveler on the 320 model. In the 3 years sailing this boat it seems A) there's never a need in such a long traveler and B) in gusts, when i get too much helm i ease with the mainsheet with the benefit of easily doing it from high or low sides.
	H320 "Curacao", Hull #085, 2008

loudon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Joined: 30 April 2023 Status: Offline Points: 34	Post Options Post Reply Quote loudon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 August 2023 at 11:45
	Hi, Funny thing, just finished installation of a full width track along with an Harken windward sheeting car, same set-up as my previous racing boats. I simply love the set-up. Did not sail much yet but in 5-6 kts going upwind, full twist, car all the way up, sheet out to get boom centered, no vang (don't tight the leach!) Going upwind in wind gusts, still trying to figure right balance between backstay tension, vang and mainsheet/traveller position balance. But for sure traveller car down to at least "mid-seat" position. Did manage to flatten the mainsail some with the backstay but it think D1 and D2 might be too tight in relation to the cap shrouds. I really enjoy sailing the H320 up to know, a "race" tuning guide from a sailmaker would have simplified the learning curve but a nice challenge for me! Next steps, jury rig an in-hauler for the 110% (right %?) to play with that trim set-up!

SailCS33 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 October 2019 Location: New Jersey, US Status: Offline Points: 188	Post Options Post Reply Quote SailCS33 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 August 2023 at 12:26
	Interesting...so my backstay doesn't actually help flatten the main. Maybe the saili doesn't have enough of the curve in the luff or maybe the mast doesn't bend forward because of the lower shrouds. I do use backstay to flatten the luff of the jib though. However, the 4:1 is not enough to do by hand so i use the aft starboard winch. I can make my main flat by outhaul, halyard and vang. I can see what you mean about light wind twist in the roach. Small trade off for me since I sail 90% alone and not race. Autopilot steers and I trim. Maximum pointing upwind is no as critical for me and I can fall off 20deg to pick up a knot. Val
	H320 "Curacao", Hull #085, 2008

loudon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Joined: 30 April 2023 Status: Offline Points: 34	Post Options Post Reply Quote loudon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 August 2023 at 16:37
	I added another cascade in my backstay, got rid of the wires for dyneema + ratchet fiddle block, so from standard 8:1 end up with 16:1 on an 8:1 ratchet, so pretty easy to pull. The oem briddle block on my boat was seized from not beeing used so did not help at all. Your 4:1 is pulling on on 2:1 briddle so you should have 8:1, but I agree, can't pull properly. The H350 cousin has an 16:1 set-up. I still have to toy around with the diagonal D1 and D2 tensions as I think everything is over-tensionned on my boat, just bought it last spring! I had to get my J/70 tradded for something more acceptable for my wife, I am just living the dream that the H320 can be quick!!

SailCS33 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 October 2019 Location: New Jersey, US Status: Offline Points: 188	Post Options Post Reply Quote SailCS33 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 August 2023 at 16:44
	When you get a chance could you please share some pictures of how you setup your cascade on the backstay?
	H320 "Curacao", Hull #085, 2008

Martin&Rene Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Vice Admiral Joined: 06 December 2009 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 967	Post Options Post Reply Quote Martin&Rene Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 August 2023 at 16:59
	I was thinking whether this thread had drifted a bit, but since you have added an additional question, then you may be interested in my backstay adjustment. I had a new shorter final wire made up to replace the one that used to be fastened to the hull and then terminated this on the top of the original jammer. I then just added a 4 part purchase on to the final end of the original backstay rope using a standard dinghy mainsheet jammer. I pull up the backstay tight with the original system to set the standard setting and then use the new purchase when the wind increases and it is very easy to do one handed. This system will bend the mast overall, but for me the main benefit is that as the top of the mast has bent then the leech of the mainsail has opened up and the weather helm decreases. Its seems to give me another couple of knots of apparent wind before I need to reef
	Martin&Rene Hanse 341 Dipper Wheel steering, 3 cabin layout, normally based in Scotland



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