411 and broken mast

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Hi Bernd,

I saw your
mail regarding broken mast under broken rudder. I start a new subject. Can you
please tell a little more how it happened and what you have improved to prevent
it happen again. I have a 411 and of course a mast coming down is a disaster. I
have a Spar Craft rig. Any advices will be appreciated. I did address Hanse on this topic but no response.

Jøvani

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Jøvani Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 April 2009 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 175	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jøvani Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 411 and broken mast Posted: 22 January 2012 at 17:22
	Hi Bernd, I saw your mail regarding broken mast under broken rudder. I start a new subject. Can you please tell a little more how it happened and what you have improved to prevent it happen again. I have a 411 and of course a mast coming down is a disaster. I have a Spar Craft rig. Any advices will be appreciated. I did address Hanse on this topic but no response. Jøvani
	Jøvani Hanse 411 #189 Tønsberg Norway

Bernd vh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Sub Lieutenant Joined: 22 January 2012 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 13	Post Options Post Reply Quote Bernd vh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 January 2012 at 21:38
	hi Jovani, our first breakdown happened in spring 2004, crashing at at the first spreaders access holes, upwind sailing in 5 bft, luckily near the coast and our home port. Neither the yard nor the insurance could tell us any reaseon why this caused, bur anything was paid and repaird in a shot time. Thin then I took advice of professional riggers and read everything about masts and rigging, but the next break came during Hansecup round Rügen in autumn 2007. It happened in the same way as the first time, therig an sails were in perfect shape and again nobody had any idea why this could happen.The boat stayed in the yard over winter, for the season 2008 we got a complete new rig, now from Selden ( my wish) custom made. Since then we are happy with the new Mast, which seems to be stronger and of better quality. I think we are the first hanse with Selden rig. Bernd
	Hanse 411 nr 69

Jøvani Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 April 2009 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 175	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jøvani Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 January 2012 at 22:28
	Hi, Thanks a lot for your response. I did hear of another 411 here in Norway that experienced the same as you, never been in contact with him. But understand he got a Selden rig as well. It is a scaring situation and strange that Hanse does not revert on my mail. I will for sure carefully inspect the area at the first spreaders before the 2012 season. Jøvani
	Jøvani Hanse 411 #189 Tønsberg Norway

Bernd vh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Sub Lieutenant Joined: 22 January 2012 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 13	Post Options Post Reply Quote Bernd vh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 January 2012 at 23:09
	so far i can see the last 411 boats have a tapered mast ( as my selden mast), maybe an improvment to reduce the vertical compression. Did not hear that there was a significant number of of accidents like we had with the 411 Bernd
	Hanse 411 nr 69

Jøvani Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 April 2009 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 175	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jøvani Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 23 January 2012 at 07:20
	May be good news for me , how do I find out if I have a tapered mast? I will be on travel for a few days, but will try to inspect at the end of the week. Jøvani
	Jøvani Hanse 411 #189 Tønsberg Norway

Bernd vh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Sub Lieutenant Joined: 22 January 2012 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 13	Post Options Post Reply Quote Bernd vh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 23 January 2012 at 21:06
	when the diameter of the mast profile gets slightly smaller to the top, beginning at the forestay fix point, then you have a tapered mast. (sorry, I am am fighting with the language) Bernd
	Hanse 411 nr 69

Jøvani Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Captain Joined: 20 April 2009 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 175	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jøvani Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 23 January 2012 at 21:47
	No problem with your language. Probably the same for all us communicating in a language not being our mother tongue language. I think I understand, the upper part get gradually slimmer from the forestay and up. May be resulting in more flexibility? In my home harbor there is another 411, an much earlier production number I think. I will try to compare at the end of the week. regards Jøvani
	Jøvani Hanse 411 #189 Tønsberg Norway

ernol Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Commander Joined: 07 July 2006 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 67	Post Options Post Reply Quote ernol Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 January 2012 at 10:44
	Hi, The first few Hanse 411 produced have a rig from Z-spar like the Hanse 401. From 2002/2003 they change to Sparcraft and I think all the sparcraft masts on the 411 are tapered at the end. In Norway at least 3 411 have had a sparcraft mast that broke. It is therefor that some of 411 owners have made improvement with a innerforstay and backstay. There is at least one post from Samba with pictures of this solution. If I remember right has Samba the backstay from under the upperspreaders but most of the boats here in Norway they are running from a point 50 cm above the upperspreader. I don`t know if this is of any importance Erno

Bandy Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Lieutenant Commander Joined: 25 May 2004 Location: Holland Status: Offline Points: 77	Post Options Post Reply Quote Bandy Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 January 2012 at 11:48
	Bandy is a 411 from 2003 and has a Sparcraft rig. We have been sailing from the Netherlands to several countries including Norway (2010) and to Sweden in 2011. We own her from new. We have had no issues with the rig so far. I did however install an extra forestay (removable from dyneema) which we can use for a smaller jib (14m2) on longer trips in bad weather. We sheet that jib on the selftacking rail. Normally we use a 100% as a standard. Benno, Hanse 411-083, 2003 Holland

Bernd vh Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Sub Lieutenant Joined: 22 January 2012 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 13	Post Options Post Reply Quote Bernd vh Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 January 2012 at 19:51
	Hi Benno, nice picture ! As to be seen your mast is not tapered at the top, as mine was when delivered in july 2003. i think, the mast was changed with the last edition of the 411 range (2004?), which got some changes in the deck layout. I am sure that Jovanis boat belongs to the last edition regards bernd
	Hanse 411 nr 69



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