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Hanse 630 or Hanse 540 for solo circumnavigation

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oceanbluesail09 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 18 July 2008 at 19:13
Hi Everyone, i am new to this forum.
I intend to undertake a solo circumnavigation around the globe, via the three capes. solo. non-stop and unsupported.

I am looking for a yacht of approx 60 ft in length.
Rigging for easy handling by one person. Other modifications that will need to be done to customise it for the journey include extra watertigh compartments fore and aft, crash boxes etc.

I have been seriously considering the Hanse 54 and the Hanse 63.

(The other options are
Marten 49 - very expensive , about 1.5 million, but an all carbon yacht

Jenneau SunOdessy DS - well built (from what Ive heard), better than the
Beneteau

Swan 60 - heavy yacht, very expensive

What are your thoughts on the suitability of the Hanse 54 or 63 for such a voyage thru the southern ocean.
In terms of
1. build quality
2. handling ease
3. reliability & safety

would appreciate any help on this , thanks


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Rubato View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rubato Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 July 2008 at 19:33

Hello there, welcome to the forum. I'm a Hanse 400 owner so can't speak to the 54 and 63 specifically but....   All Hanse's are built to a price point, they are some of the most economical boats for a given size. The main structures (hull, deck,...) are built well, are durable and they are performance oriented. A good base to build on. When it comes to more equipment testing situations like racing or long open ocean treks you will also require durability and reliability which is where some of the Hanse owners are a little disappointed. So upgrades are usually required to get where you want to be - blocks, halyards, etc. Perhaps this isn't as big a deal on something like the 630 as most of that is owner specified and priced accordingly from what I understand.

One comment on something like an all carbon fiber yacht - strikes me that this type of construction is not as easy to repair and the number of people trained to do so is limited...  if correct, not my choice for what you plan.
 
Cheers, Steve
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colincooper View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote colincooper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 July 2008 at 19:42
Blimey you are brave.  I assume you have the experience for such a voyage.  Sorry to ask, but best to be safe.
 
Generally the Hanses are well set up for shorthanded sailing.  Several have crossed oceans.  I'm assuming that you will be customising it heavily thought so the "factory" options would be of little consequence.
 
I think all of the members of this site would be very interested to hear more as you plan and sail around.  Especially if you do choose the Hanse.  Do the Hanse factory know of your plans?
 
On your questions:
1. better than most manufacturers.
2. very nice with short-crew.  Unsure about Southern Ocean though.
3. if it were me I'd speak to someone that had done the Southern Ocean at least.
Colin (owner of Hilde - a 370)
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oceanbluesail09 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oceanbluesail09 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 July 2008 at 19:42
Hi Steve, thanks for the quick reply. Just to clarify, are u saying that an all carbon fiber yacht (that is not easy to repair) would not be your choice?

The upside of going with a production yacht is that spares and support is readily available.
THe pricing for the 540 is about 600,000 Eur (customized), as given to be by the dealer. The pricing for the 630 (just an extra 11 feet) is 1 million Eur!!!

No idea why the huge jump in price...

What other yachts would you be looking at if you had to undertake such a voyage (assuming a budget of about 900,000 - inclusive of all customisations).

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colincooper View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote colincooper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 July 2008 at 19:45
Originally posted by Rubato Rubato wrote:

not as easy to repair and the number of people trained to do so is limited

 
Especially on a non-stop solo voyage Wink
Colin (owner of Hilde - a 370)
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oceanbluesail09 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oceanbluesail09 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 July 2008 at 19:57
Hi Colin thanks. Yes, been doing my research, and speaking to as many ppl as possible. Was going to go in for an open 60 earlier, but have decided othersie, as 1. they are quite expensive to run and maintain and get fitted out for such a voyage 2. there is not much that can be done with it afterwards.

hence the option to go with a Hanse or similar as a base and then re-enforce it.

I love the hanse design and the fact that it is very good value for money.
After all, even the Hugo Boss Open 60 lost its keel andthere were a couple of capsizes over the Venedee Global and Velux 5 races. So the Open 60 is not much of a gurantee i suppose :)



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Richard108 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 July 2008 at 04:51
I have just about finished fitting out my Hanse 540 for longer distance sailing (not nearly as long as what you propose though) and now realise that with any of the production boats that to get them to a stage that I would be comfortable to do what you plan their is more work, cost and time (to make the chosen additions and modifications) needed than expected.    There are many extras that you might not at first consider including things like
 
More manual and electric bilge pumps
Many more strong points and handholds
Fitting out of storage places for sails and other storage
Making better access to things like the chain plates behind and under furniture
as well as all the expected additions.
 
I would also suggest you need to inspect the structure of any boat you look at.  The Hanse range is better than most of the lower priced production boats with glassed in bulk heads well secured keel etc, but is does not have glassed in hull to structural beams.   It takes quite some work to make these sort of modifications if you consider them necessary as you will have to start removing fixed in floor boards and furniture.
 
I would also suggest allowing a time to do a decent shake down voyage to test the boat and all the things in it and then yet more time to fix and modify as necessary.
 
I only have had my Hanse for a bit less than a year and am half way through a 2,000 nm round trip up the east Australian coast.  I have been very happy with how the boat has handle in the conditions met so far, but this trip is nothing like what you plan.
 
The other great thing about a Hanse is this forum that can be a huge resource of information, ideas and feedback about setting up and using your Hanse.
Regards Richard



("Moksha" 540 #115 delivered Sept 2007)

Pittwater, Sydney, Australia
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oceanbluesail09 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oceanbluesail09 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 July 2008 at 19:43
Hi Richard, thanks for the reply.
this forum is incredibly useful.


I did have a few replies saying that to modify a production boat is quite expensive, Here is one I quote

start quote
"Buying any production boat means you are paying a large fee for marketing, service, brand recognition, tooling, fancy interior furnishings, and styling.  Lowest on the list are the sailing qualities and construction of the basic structure.  IMO one would be making a big mistake (financial among other things) to modify a new production boat for such a voyage.  None of the boats mentioned are intended for such work, why not spend less for a design and structure actually intended for such a voyage?"

end quote.

Im not sure if the above is applicable to the hanse.
Yet, to design and build a new 60ft boat from scratch is going to be very expensive and it will also take a lot of time. I checked with a few designers such as Owen Clarke and we were looking at about Eur 2 million to start.

The Hanse dealer I spoke to mentioned an 8 week production period. It sounds quite quick to me.  What has been your experience with the production time? Do they deliver on schedule?

I plan to start next November. So looking to place the order for the 630  or 540 in Jan.

Do you think this is sufficient time?

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Richard108 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 July 2008 at 09:27

Hi Ocean Blues

I can't comment on the suitability of a Hanse for your journey from any of my experience. 

I ordered my 540 in early November 2006 and it was handed over to me in mid Sept 2007.  Delivery time is very dependant on what the Hanse dealer has preordered for the year.

I left for my first long trip 1,000nm one way in June 2008 and there was hardly a week since receiving the boat that I did not have someone working on the boat over the previous 9 months.  Most of this work was extras and alterations, though there was a few weeks of warranty work.  Since being away a whole lot of little issues have come up that have needed constant work and fine tuning, fuses, relays, loose tail shaft bolts, autopilot problems etc. 

If I was you and Hanse was the boat (which I would probably question) you would need to find a team of reliably and focused tradesman including sail maker, rigger, shipwright, stainless steel worker, Marine electricians etc to be able to get the work done in the time you are wanting and then allow for a good shakedown sail of probably at least 500nm. 
 
So I would think that from order to departure you would be lucky to do it in a year and a half going from my experience.
Regards Richard



("Moksha" 540 #115 delivered Sept 2007)

Pittwater, Sydney, Australia
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woolf View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote woolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 July 2008 at 10:38
hey. I would say check such guys already doing close to your intention to do. solo circumnavigation around the globe. here is the one with Open 85 ft Monohull: http://konyukhov.ru/eng/
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