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steering system changes |
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JonB 
Rear Admiral 
Joined: 21 September 2010 Location: Cowes Status: Offline Points: 504 |
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 Posted: 10 April 2023 at 20:55 |
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Suggest you convert to a twin rudder system that way you might, might, just have a second rudder available to actually steer if you can turn it.
If they ram the rudder then the stock will be bent and no matter what system you have you'll not be able to turn it. Suggest you buy a submarine.
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Jon B
470e http://www.norse-king.blogspot.co.uk |
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psousa
Lieutenant Commander 
Joined: 23 January 2021 Status: Offline Points: 50 |
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Posted: 14 December 2023 at 14:37 |
It's JEFA steering, yes. Your autopilot drive it's possibly an hydraulic or linear unit while mine is a sprocket drive (works directly on the steering chain). If the steering linkage broke for some reason, I completely loose manoeuvrability (manual or auto). This is my current Jefa autopilot sprocket drive unit:  Wind pilot is clearly an option, if is one of those which can work as an emergency rudder. If I can recall correctly, not all can do that.
Edited by psousa - 14 December 2023 at 16:07 |
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psousa
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 23 January 2021 Status: Offline Points: 50 |
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Posted: 14 December 2023 at 16:01 |
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Regarding orcas, I live and sail here, on one of the most affected coast lines, and I keep watching several different cases on the local boatyards. Anyway I just give it as an example as an attack don't necessarily ripoff all your rudder. They can break linkages only (then a link backup will work) when hit/ram the rudder, they can damage only a part of the rudder (you're still able to manoeuvre to shore), but yes, they can completely rip it off (you may need to use an alternative as some wrote here and is extensively described on some of the most popular books about emergencies at sea), they can slightly bent your rudder shaft (you may still use it with limited amplitude), they may completely bent it (unusable), I saw also one broken quadrant and I even saw more than one skeg rudders completely damaged (some people believes they are able to handle an attack better than the spade rudders). Last year a Beneteau Ciclades just sunk off our coast as the impact cracked the fiberglass where the rudder stock get into the boat! Regarding this one I think we're a bit safer (just a bit as no one is safe if these big animals wants to sink your boat). I was able to compare my 470 rudder stock insertion setup with the Cyclades rudder stock insertion as we were discussing this on a whatsapp group and someone have sent some pictures of the rudder stock insertion on a Cyclades and it's completely insane. It's almost transparent!
Anyway, for these or hundred of other reasons, I think it's important to discuss backup/emergency solutions. And I reming myself about this today because, again, on a ARC crossing, another Hanse lost rudder linkage. This year's ARC:  An heads up here to the fact that they have a steering linkage independent autopilot drive unit which allowed them to keep moving on with manoeuvrability, even with a broken steering linkage. An independent autopilot drive, connected to the quadrant or, somehow, directly to the rudder stock, was one of my solutions wrote on the first post. I still believe it's a reliable one. I may decide to install one of these drives) while I'll keep my current sprocket drive working directly on the steering chain as a backup (a spare/backup autopilot drive is always a good idea on long passages). I keep a link to another similar situation, also on an Hanse (a 588), 2 years ago. Curiously during the ARC as well: https://www.sail-world.com/news/244418/ARC-2021-Yacht-Charlotte-Jane-III-abandoned This one with 2 independent steering linkages but the second one eventually failed as well, after some time.
Edited by psousa - 14 December 2023 at 16:12 |
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Tfeyzioglu
Sub Lieutenant 
Joined: 18 May 2024 Location: Yalikavak Status: Offline Points: 2 |
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Posted: 19 May 2024 at 20:33 |
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Greetings. Is the Jefa Transmission Steering System significantly better than the Lewmar Transmission Steering System? My wife and I have a Hanse 588 built in 2020, with Lewmar Transmission Steering System. The starboard transmission box started to get stuck at around 25 degrees starboard. The wheel chain continues to turn the rod on the side of the box, but the lever on top of the box stops moving and starts to show signs that a gear inside the box is skipping. At that point the wheel locks up completely. The port transmission box is also not healthy: after detaching the starboard wheel chain, the port side transmission box gets stuck around 15 degrees starboard, but gets unstuck if I move the wheel back and forth with sufficient degree, which is quite undesirable. I believe we started to see these problems after going in reverse and losing control of the wheel, which got yanked to the starboard side. We seem to have two options: Since the boat is in Yalikavak, Bodrum, Türkiye, we can have the boxes removed, opened, and damaged gears manufactured, which is expensive. Or we can replace the whole steering system from Lewmar to Jefa, which is much much more expensive. A discussion thread in 2021 suggested that Jefa systems were much better than Lewmar. Is that view still valid? Many thanks for your response. Tarhan |
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marsella
Rear Admiral
Joined: 21 June 2022 Location: Antigua Jolly H Status: Offline Points: 592 |
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Posted: 20 May 2024 at 02:40 |
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Jefa is a reputable company but for anyone installing their steering, I strongly suggest reading this thread
as my rolling chain failed just after three years due to corrosion. Their supplied chains are made in China and I ended up changing the broken chain to Lewmar (their supplier is in Spain) although some forum folk even recommended Tsubaki (couldn't find the right length unfortunately). All this needs a careful research, there is a lot of cost cutting everywhere, which unfortunately leads to serious accidents at sea. |
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Tfeyzioglu
Sub Lieutenant
Joined: 18 May 2024 Location: Yalikavak Status: Offline Points: 2 |
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Posted: 20 May 2024 at 07:38 |
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Thank you Marsella for bringing this issue to my attention. Indeed, cost cutting by Hanse may be a possible source of my problem, especially if they installed the Lewmar steering system to reduce their costs.
For this specific case, I checked and the chains are in perfect condition. Tarhan
Edited by Tfeyzioglu - 20 May 2024 at 07:38 |
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Arcadia
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Joined: 27 November 2017 Location: Sag Harbor, USA Status: Online Points: 1112 |
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Posted: 20 May 2024 at 15:57 |
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Hello Tarhan. The Lewmar gears are for su.re inferior to the Jefa. I changed mine on my 588 to Jefa a few years ago and it made a big difference in friction and force. My Lewmars did not fail, but I wasnt happy with the performance. I still have my two Lewmar gear boxes if anyone is interested.
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Leon / ARCADIA
2018 Hanse 588 Sag Harbor, NY |
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johnyred wrote: